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CLDR Ticket #11416(closed: fixed)

Opened 3 months ago

Last modified 2 weeks ago

Rename Kiev to Kyiv

Reported by: dmytro.krekota@… Owned by: pedberg
Component: timezone Data Locale:
Phase: dsub Review: srl
Weeks: Data Xpath:
Xref:

ticket:10185

Description

Hi, why do you use Kiev instead of Kyiv in your charts (timezones.europe.html)? I live in the capital of Ukraine and it calls Kyiv (not Kiev).

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Change History

comment:1 Changed 3 months ago by doug@…

If this is the data derived from the IANA (Olson) time zone database, it is using "Europe/Kiev" as an identifier, not as the linguistically correct form of the city name. To quote the comment in the source file, "'Kyiv' is the transliteration of the Ukrainian name, but 'Kiev' is more common in English."

comment:2 Changed 3 months ago by dmytro.krekota@…

Ok, but Kyiv is used everywhere in Kyiv, just see official Kyiv logos in Google. Also, it is the official English name of the city in our country. But, thank you for the response.

comment:3 follow-up: ↓ 5 Changed 3 months ago by doug@…

Are you talking about an internal identifier, or a translated string that would be visible to some end user? (Sorry, I don't know where the HTML is that you're referring to.)

comment:4 Changed 2 months ago by srl

  • Xref set to 10185

relates to ticket:10185 which was closed.

comment:5 in reply to: ↑ 3 Changed 2 months ago by srl

Replying to doug@…:

Are you talking about an internal identifier, or a translated string that would be visible to some end user? (Sorry, I don't know where the HTML is that you're referring to.)

The chart is https://www.unicode.org/cldr/charts/latest/by_type/timezones.europe.html#6dd1046c581ae238

comment:6 follow-up: ↓ 7 Changed 2 months ago by class.od.ua@…

I have an answer from IANA and they reffer to unicode.org, so how to break this circle!?

comment:7 in reply to: ↑ 6 ; follow-up: ↓ 8 Changed 2 months ago by srl

Replying to class.od.ua@…:

I have an answer from IANA and they reffer to unicode.org, so how to break this circle!?

It's not a circle. The IANA TZ identifier is just an identifier. It doesn't matter what the IANA identifier is, because users shouldn't see it. As you can see from the chart link above, CLDR translates this identifier to "Київ" in Ukranian. CLDR and IANA TZ have different purposes, and refer to each other for their respective purposes.

CLDR is not a tool for making a change in common use. Instead, you need to talk to dictionaries, mapmakers, etc.

comment:8 in reply to: ↑ 7 Changed 2 months ago by class.od.ua@…

We are not asking you to make a change to common use, we are pointing you a mistakes in chart according to https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:code:3166:UA which is a common use standard.

Replying to srl:

Replying to class.od.ua@…:

I have an answer from IANA and they reffer to unicode.org, so how to break this circle!?

It's not a circle. The IANA TZ identifier is just an identifier. It doesn't matter what the IANA identifier is, because users shouldn't see it. As you can see from the chart link above, CLDR translates this identifier to "Київ" in Ukranian. CLDR and IANA TZ have different purposes, and refer to each other for their respective purposes.

CLDR is not a tool for making a change in common use. Instead, you need to talk to dictionaries, mapmakers, etc.

comment:9 Changed 4 weeks ago by mark

  • Milestone changed from UNSCH to to-assess

comment:10 Changed 4 weeks ago by mark

It appears that "Kiev" is the more customary spelling in English.

comment:11 Changed 4 weeks ago by mark

  • Owner changed from anybody to srl
  • Priority changed from assess to major
  • Status changed from new to accepted
  • Component changed from unknown to timezone
  • Milestone changed from to-assess to 35

Consensus to add alt="formal" Kyiv

comment:12 Changed 2 weeks ago by srl

  • Owner changed from srl to pedberg

comment:13 Changed 2 weeks ago by pedberg

  • Status changed from accepted to reviewing
  • Review set to srl

Added both the standard name (same as code fallback, may be minimized away?)

  <exemplarCity>Kiev</exemplarCity>

and the alt=formal (new path required some test updates).

  <exemplarCity alt="formal">Kyiv</exemplarCity>

comment:14 Changed 2 weeks ago by srl

  • Status changed from reviewing to closed
  • Resolution set to fixed
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