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CLDR Ticket #4641(closed: fix-in-surveytool)

Opened 7 years ago

Last modified 3 weeks ago

nl: time format

Reported by: public@… Owned by: anybody
Component: fix-in-survey-tool Data Locale:
Phase: Review:
Weeks: Data Xpath:


I was pointed to this project (great work!) by a Wikipedia blog post.
I apologise if I report this in the wrong place.

The current time format for the Dutch (nl) locale is "HH:mm".

While I would typically write this, it is considered wrong. At least when I wrote a book, the editor correct this for me, and I think she was right. The correct writing style depends on the context.

http://taaladvies.net/taal/advies/vraag/1278/8h30_8u30_830_u_830_uur/ gives a thorough review with references.

Normal text: "8.30" or "8.30 u." or "8.30 uur"
Scientific text: "8:30" or "8h30")

Note that most computers and clocks display "8:30", probably because initial users of digital equipment were already used to the scientific notation, and manufacturers never bothered to change it. It can be argued that since so many have been exposed to this format, both formats are allowed, even though the former "8.30" style is still the official recommendation.

My suggestion would be to change the the "Hm" time format from "HH:mm" to "HH.mm" and leave others intact. (One reference listed at the above URL suggest changing Hms to "HH.mm:ss", but I've rarely seen that in practise.)

As a side-note: all *-past-one values at http://st.unicode.org/cldr-apps/survey?_=nl&x=Patterns_for_Units are grammatically incorrect (e.g. "voor 1 etmalen geleden" is not valid Dutch). Good solutions are either "gisteren" (= yesterday), "1 dag geleden" (= 1 day ago), "één dag geleden" (= one day ago) or "een dag geleden" (= a day ago). Since I could not find an authoritative source on the difference between the "*-past-one" and "*-past-1" keys I did not feel comfortable to change the content. (As a side-note: "een etmaal geleden" is a another option, but really means "24 hours ago", not entirely the same as a "yesterday": If it is now 11:00, you can say "gisteren om 16.00" = yesterday at 16:00, but you can't say "een etmaal geleden om 16.00" = 24hours ago at 16:00).

Hope this helps a bit.


Change History

comment:1 Changed 7 years ago by kent.karlsson14@…

"een etmaal geleden" is a another option, but really means "24 hours ago",

Yes, this is what is sought after.

not entirely the same as a "yesterday":

True, but "yesterday" and related words are asked for elsewhere in CLDR.

comment:2 Changed 7 years ago by mark

  • Status changed from new to closed
  • Resolution set to needs-more-info
  • Component changed from data to next-survey

Please enter this information in via the Survey tool, and post your comments to the forum. See http://cldr.unicode.org/index/survey-tool

comment:3 Changed 7 years ago by mark

  • Status changed from closed to reopened
  • Resolution needs-more-info deleted

comment:4 Changed 7 years ago by mark

  • Status changed from reopened to closed
  • Resolution set to fix-in-surveytool

comment:5 Changed 7 years ago by pedberg

  • Cc hkeuper@… added

comment:6 Changed 4 years ago by markus

  • Milestone changed from UNSCH to 22

Trying to restore clobbered milestones.

comment:7 Changed 3 weeks ago by mark

  • Component changed from next-survey to fix-in-survey-tool

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