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CLDR Ticket #9778(accepted data)

Opened 15 months ago

Last modified 2 months ago

Comments on CLDR 30 alpha, locale sv (main)

Reported by: kent.karlsson14@… Owned by: fredrik
Component: main Data Locale: sv
Phase: rc Review:
Weeks: Data Xpath:
Xref:

Description


<dateFormatItem id="MMMMW" count="one">'vecka' W 'i' MMM</dateFormatItem>

Does not make much sense, too fuzzy, no formal definition of "week in month" cutoff day.
Furthermore: NEVER used in Scandinavia (at least).

<dateFormatItem id="MMMMW" count="other">'vecka' W 'i' MMM</dateFormatItem>

Does not make sense for any language; always singular week! (Showstopper...)

<dateFormatItem id="yw" count="one">'vecka' w, y</dateFormatItem>

While this one does make sense (for those of us that actually adhere to the
ISO standard, like in Scandinavia), basically only administrators use it.
"Ordinary people" just get confused and have to look up when it is, which is
a constant problem). For those not really using the ISO standard, this one
does not make sense, even for administrators.

<dateFormatItem id="yw" count="other">'vecka' w, y</dateFormatItem>

Does not make sense for any language; always singular week! (Showstopper...)



<relativeTimePattern count="one">om {0} tis.</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="other">om {0} tis.</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="one">för {0} tis. sen</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="other">för {0} tis. sen</relativeTimePattern>

These should say "tisd." (for consistency with "månd."); likewise for the other weekdays and relativeTimePattern/short.

<relativeTimePattern count="one">+{0} tis</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="other">+{0} tis</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="one">−{0} tis</relativeTimePattern>
<relativeTimePattern count="other">−{0} tis</relativeTimePattern>

These should say "ti" (for consistency with "må"); likewise for the other weekdays and relativeTimePattern/narrow.



<zone type="Etc/Unknown">

<exemplarCity>okänd stad</exemplarCity>

This one should say "okänd tidszon" (unknown timezone), since it is the timezone that is unknown, and hence
does not have an exemplar city, not that the "city is unknown" (which would be a moot statement).



<exponential>×10</exponential>
<superscriptingExponent>×</superscriptingExponent>

Using × here is strange. Please use middle dot (not the dot operator, wrong spacing).



<unit type="area-square-yard">

<displayName>yard²</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0} engelsk kvadratyard</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} yard²</unitPattern>

</unit>

That should be:

<unit type="area-square-yard">

<displayName>engelska kvadratyard</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0} engelsk kvadratyard</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} engelska kvadratyard</unitPattern>

</unit>



<unit type="volume-pint-metric">

<displayName>pint à 500 ml</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0} pint à 500 ml</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} pint à 500 ml</unitPattern>

</unit>
<unit type="volume-cup-metric">

<displayName>koppar à 2,5 dl</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0} kopp à 2,5 dl</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} koppar à 2,5 dl</unitPattern>

</unit>

While not wrong as they are, it might be better to use centilitre for these.
(Also for the short and narrow versions.)



<unitPattern count="one">{0} mi²</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} mi²</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/en.mil²</perUnitPattern>

Those should be

<unitPattern count="one">{0} en.mil²</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0} en.mil²</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/en.mil²</perUnitPattern>



<unit type="duration-year">

<displayName>år</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0}å</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0}å</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/år</perUnitPattern>

</unit>

That should be (also for narrow):

<unit type="duration-year">

<displayName>år</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0}år</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0}år</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/år</perUnitPattern>

</unit>



<unit type="duration-month">

<displayName>m</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0}m</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0}m</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/mån</perUnitPattern>

</unit>

That should be:

<unit type="duration-month">

<displayName>mån</displayName>
<unitPattern count="one">{0}mån</unitPattern>
<unitPattern count="other">{0}mån</unitPattern>
<perUnitPattern draft="contributed">{0}/mån</perUnitPattern>

</unit>


Attachments

Change History

comment:1 Changed 14 months ago by mark

  • Owner changed from anybody to fredrik
  • Priority changed from assess to medium
  • Status changed from new to accepted
  • Milestone changed from UNSCH to 30

comment:2 Changed 14 months ago by pedberg

  • Cc fredrik, pedberg, yoshito added

Peter to comment on first section, Yoshito to comment on city for Etc/Unknown, Fredrik to look at other items

comment:3 Changed 14 months ago by yoshito

<zone type="Etc/Unknown">

<exemplarCity>okänd stad</exemplarCity>

This one should say "okänd tidszon" (unknown timezone), since it is the timezone that is unknown, and hence
does not have an exemplar city, not that the "city is unknown" (which would be a moot statement).


Exemplar city value is used for constructing "Generic location format" http://www.unicode.org/reports/tr35/tr35-dates.html#Time_Zone_Format_Terminology. CLDR does not define any other 'use cases', but it could be used for region based time zone selection.

If you say "Unknown timezone" here, "Generic location format" becomes "Unknown timezone time" with English locale. So I disagree with above. (Although the generic location format composed by current value "Unknown city time" does not look great.)

In general, zone Etc/Unknown is used as fallback for erroneous cases - and should be excluded from regular time zone selection list.

Anyway, in my opinion, considering the possible use cases, I think it's fine with "Unknown city" (okänd stad) - because this value is used in the context already implying time zone.

comment:4 Changed 14 months ago by pedberg

  • Phase changed from dsub to rc

comment:5 Changed 14 months ago by pedberg

Regarding the first comment about the “week of...” items: Yes, the structure and usage for these needs some refinement.

I added comments about that to the CLDR 30 draft release note in a Warnings and Errata section, to wit:


The structure and intended usage for the “week x of y” patterns is still being refined and may change. This applies especially to dateFormatItems such as the following:

    <dateFormatItem id="MMMMW" count=...>'week' W 'of' MMM</dateFormatItem>
    <dateFormatItem id="yw" count=...>'week' w 'of' y</dateFormatItem>

Areas of discussion include the use of the count attribute and the use of ordinal vs. cardinal numbers.


I believe the count attributes were there with the intent of supporting ordinal numbers, but that part of it did not make itinto the data collection.

comment:6 Changed 14 months ago by fredrik

  • Milestone changed from 30 to 31

I'll hold the ticket for the remaining comments on Swedish localization. We should split off the part about cardinal vs. ordinal week numbers into a different ticket.

comment:7 Changed 10 months ago by fredrik

  • Milestone changed from 31 to 32

comment:8 Changed 2 months ago by emmons

  • Milestone changed from 32 to 33
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