Am 1999-08-23 um 0:22 H hat Markus Kuhn geschrieben: > Would it be possible to add to LATIN SMALL LETTER SHARP S U+00DF a > cross-reference to U+0073 + U+017f in the Unicode 3.0 book? [...] > Making the reader aware that the sharp s derives > historically from a U+0073 + U+017f ligature will hopefully lead font > designers without experience in German typography to coming up with more > appropriate glyphs than the common beta variant. Actually, the Sharp-S is derived from a ligature of U+017F followed by U+0292, and I suggest to add a remark to U+00DF saying so. In medeaval writing of German, U+0292 denoted a voiceless S sound, which had replaced the T sound during the 2nd (German) sound-shift (aka Grimm's law). Later (about 14th century), the U+0292 glyph was used for the German Z character (pronounced ts), and the former U+0292 was replaced with SZ (S plus U+0292, i. e. an U+0292 to be pronounced like an S). In German hand- writing and print, S was written with two different characters (Round S U+0073, and Long S U+017F, depending on particular spelling rules). According to these rules, the above mentioned SZ was regularly written as U+017F U+0292, which formed a ligature and eventually evolved into U+00DF, a character named "Eszet" (in reminiscence of its genesis). E. g. "Teuerdank", printed in 1517, of which I own a facsimile, uses U+0073 and U+017F for (modern) S, U+0292 for (modern) Z, and a ligature of U+017F and U+0292, i. e. U+00DF, for (modern) ß ("modern" to be understood modulo later spelling reforms, of course). And so did all Fraktur prints until the early 20th century, as far as I have seen (and if memory does serve me alright -- I have not checked this detail). Cf. Jacob Grimm: "Deutsches Wörterbuch", vol. 8, fasc. 8 (1963), col. 1573 and 1574. In German hand-writing and print (Fraktur), the U+017F glyph has a descender (in contrast to the example given in the Unicode Standard 2.0). So have U+0292, and the resulting ligature. In roman print (Antiqua), U+017F usually does not have a descender (as the example glyph given in the Unicode Standard). Consequently, the U+0292 part of the ligature is raised to the ground line, resulting in the example glyph given for U+00DF. In some Antiqua fonts, however, the right part is rather derived from the U+0073 (Round S) glyph, as in the fonts Albertus medium (Hewlett-Packard), Book Antiqua (Hewlett-Packard), Bookman Old Style (Monotype), Univers (Hewlett-Packard), and less conspicuously in Arial (Monotype) that comes with every MS-Windows installation. Also the renowned typographer Jan Tschichold, has adopted the view (in contrast to the history established by J. Grimm, and elsewhere) that "ß" were derived from a ligature of Long-S and Round-S (U+017F and U+0073), and has designed his fonts, accordingly. Best wishes, Otto Stolz